inside Oracle database development

[Chris Stephens]

https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=oraguy

too interesting and relevant to not post.

sounds like a nightmare.

[Chris Stephens]

agree on #1.

not sure i agree with the full sentiment of #2. :)

Having worked there also, I have two conclusions about the Oracle
1. It’s miracle it works at all. (As the author says)
2. It’s even more impressive that it works so amazingly well!
*Sent:* Friday, November 16, 2018 10:12 AM
*To:* oracle-l
*Subject:* inside Oracle database development
https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=oraguy
too interesting and relevant to not post.
sounds like a nightmare.

[Tim Gorman]

I recall a verbal version of this exact conversation in the early 1990s,
like 1991 or 1992 or so.  I recall the person only mentioned 10 million
lines and, as he had several people besides me listening, he concluded
with "it's a miracle it works at all" and basically assured anyone using
Oracle they were soon to die horribly.

Every time someone complains about "bad coding", I cringe if they're
complaining about style or appearance or programming language or some
other aesthetic.  The only true criteria that matters is "does it work",
because programming is very biological.  Good code works. Bad code
doesn't.  Really good code works for decades.  Things are added, things
die and fall away, things are repaired, things compete, and above all
things evolve.  In case you haven't dissected anything lately, biology
is not always aesthetically pleasing, but whether it is or not, it needs
to work.

Post by Chris Stephens
agree on #1.
not sure i agree with the full sentiment of #2. :)
Having worked there also, I have two conclusions about the Oracle
1. It’s miracle it works at all.  (As the author says)
2. It’s even more impressive that it works so amazingly well!
*Sent:* Friday, November 16, 2018 10:12 AM
*To:* oracle-l
*Subject:* inside Oracle database development
https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=oraguy
too interesting and relevant to not post.
sounds like a nightmare.

[Lothar Flatz]

Tim,

that is an absolutely outstanding comment .I will quote you .:-)
 I recently had a conversation with a friend in front of Saint Stephens
cathedral in Vienna.
I mentioned that the guys in those days build the cathedral without
understanding the laws of static.
Just like we our today in Software development have no mathematical rule
that will tell us what good software is.
Yet, the cathedral lasts for centuries.

Regards

Lothar

Post by Tim Gorman
I recall a verbal version of this exact conversation in the early
1990s, like 1991 or 1992 or so.  I recall the person only mentioned 10
million lines and, as he had several people besides me listening, he
concluded with "it's a miracle it works at all" and basically assured
anyone using Oracle they were soon to die horribly.
Every time someone complains about "bad coding", I cringe if they're
complaining about style or appearance or programming language or some
other aesthetic.  The only true criteria that matters is "does it
work", because programming is very biological.  Good code works.  Bad
code doesn't.  Really good code works for decades.  Things are added,
things die and fall away, things are repaired, things compete, and
above all things evolve. In case you haven't dissected anything
lately, biology is not always aesthetically pleasing, but whether it
is or not, it needs to work.

Post by Chris Stephens
agree on #1.
not sure i agree with the full sentiment of #2. :)
On Fri, Nov 16, 2018 at 10:40 AM Ric Van Dyke
Having worked there also, I have two conclusions about the Oracle
1. It’s miracle it works at all.  (As the author says)
2. It’s even more impressive that it works so amazingly well!
*Sent:* Friday, November 16, 2018 10:12 AM
*To:* oracle-l
*Subject:* inside Oracle database development
https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=oraguy
too interesting and relevant to not post.
sounds like a nightmare.

--

[Jonathan Lewis]

But, as I seem to point out fairly frequently - the cathedrals we see last for centuries because the ones that fell down almost immediately aren't around any more.

Regards
Jonathan Lewis

________________________________________
From: oracle-l-***@freelists.org <oracle-l-***@freelists.org> on behalf of Lothar Flatz <***@bluewin.ch>
Sent: 18 November 2018 09:00
To: ***@gmail.com; oracle-***@freelists.org
Subject: Re: inside Oracle database development

Tim,

that is an absolutely outstanding comment .I will quote you .:-)
I recently had a conversation with a friend in front of Saint Stephens cathedral in Vienna.
I mentioned that the guys in those days build the cathedral without understanding the laws of static.
Just like we our today in Software development have no mathematical rule that will tell us what good software is.
Yet, the cathedral lasts for centuries.

Regards

Lothar
--
http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l

[Sayan Malakshinov]

survivorship bias :)

Post by Jonathan Lewis
But, as I seem to point out fairly frequently - the cathedrals we see last
for centuries because the ones that fell down almost immediately aren't
around any more.
Regards
Jonathan Lewis

[Lothar Flatz]

Yep. Some of them stand, some doesn't. Is it a coincidence or did some
of the old builders have a feeling for how the job should be done?
As a software developer I prefer to believe the later. ;-)  I like the
conclusion: those who have the feeling are not paid well enough.

Post by Jonathan Lewis
But, as I seem to point out fairly frequently - the cathedrals we see last for centuries because the ones that fell down almost immediately aren't around any more.
Regards
Jonathan Lewis
________________________________________
Sent: 18 November 2018 09:00
Subject: Re: inside Oracle database development
Tim,
that is an absolutely outstanding comment .I will quote you .:-)
I recently had a conversation with a friend in front of Saint Stephens cathedral in Vienna.
I mentioned that the guys in those days build the cathedral without understanding the laws of static.
Just like we our today in Software development have no mathematical rule that will tell us what good software is.
Yet, the cathedral lasts for centuries.
Regards
Lothar

[Mladen Gogala]

That idea can be named "Origin of cathedrals or survival of the fittest".

Regards

Post by Jonathan Lewis
But, as I seem to point out fairly frequently - the cathedrals we see last for centuries because the ones that fell down almost immediately aren't around any more.
Regards
Jonathan Lewis